I already have a 8.2kwh battery and solar. I'm on octopus flux at the moment, which is great although only 3 hours of charge on cheap rate each night isn't ideal.
Will I be able to get a better deal if I have a car that needs charging?
Russ some of us are on Go so get 4 hours at cheaper rates. If you had an EV with compatible charger there is Intelligent Go which gets you 6 hours of cheaper energy.
Technically you need an EV for Go, but I've been on it since the beginning of December, and was on it last winter and don't have an EV.
Russ Which generation of inverter ? A G2 or G3 should be able to fully charge 8.2kWh battery in 3 hours ?
I'm on Go, which, as mentioned, gives 4 hours on 9p overnight - with 9.5kWh battery, I almost never have to import during at daytime rate (except on saving-session days, when battery does run out at the end of the day.) With Go, you get 8p/kWh for export (not that there's much of that at this time of year).
I have a Zappi chargepoint on order, which should give me access to Intelligent tariff. That's even cheaper overnight - 7.5p for 6 hours - but in additon gives 15p/kWh for export, which brings about an entirely different way of approaching things.
Depending on your mileage and array size, it's possible that Flux is better in summer, switchi g to an EV tariff for winter.
Russ if you don't have an EV, agile is also worth considering - see other threads.
DD I have a G2. It only charges at 2.4kw so it only gets to about 84% full in 3 hours from 4%. Should a G2 be able to charge at a higher rate than that?
Thanks for the info. Is go only for those with an EV?
DD thanks. What rates does agile give you?
Russ not sure - I thought g2 could do 3.5 but don't know for sure.
T&C for Go require an EV
Russ agile pricing varies every half hour. Typically quite cheap (as low as 2p) overnight, and expensive (over 50p?) 4pm to 7pm. So could work well if you can flexible about when you charge battery and run washing machine etc. Is 8.2kWh enough to get through most of the day?
See other threads for how people manage things.
Russ If you have a compatible EV or EV charger (Ohma), Octopus Intelligent Go is by far the best.
6hrs cheap, plus any additional hours the car charges.
and you are eligible for Outgoing Octopus at 15p/kwh, rather than Outgoing Lite at 8p/kwh that you get with the other GO tariffs.
Eonnext offers their Nextdrive tariff gives a 7-hour overnight cheap rate daytime is just under 34p/kWh and the night rate 9.5p/kWh also if one has this tariff and so becomes an eon customer one can get a SEG tariff of 16.5p/kWh.
Eon is not known for being the best when it comes to customer service but we have been a customer since we got transferred to them as our previous supplier went bust and they have been OK. We have been on the Nextdrive tariff for a few months now and has worked OK.
When we get the SEG paid next year we will look around to see what else is on offer.
2.4 is more in line with a g1 unless you have a cold battery.
I’m firmly in the if you don’t have an EV you shouldn’t be on any of the go tariffs band.
I do think that the providers should have a 10p for an overnight period to charge and a 15/20p boost before a peak period at say 60p for anyone with a battery.
I signed up for Go and was not asked if I had an EV. The T&Cs state that the tariff 'is designed for customers who either own or have a long-term lease of a battery electric vehicle or a plug-in hybrid vehicle that they will be charging at their home that we supply' – it says its 'designed for' it but does not say that this condition must be met to use the tariff.
Anyone charging a big battery, plus running an immersion heater, dishwasher etc will be using a comparable amount of juice to someone topping up an EV.
I believe the 8.2kw battery will only charge at 2.6kw whatever the Gen inverter you have. The 9.5kw will charge at 3.6 for a Gen 2 or 3. The actual charging rate you get into the battery will be less due to the conversion from ac to dc.
I have a Gen 1 inverter plus a 9.5kw battery which will only charge at 2600w (2420w with losses) which is the opposite to you. You have a Gen2 which will charge at 3600w on a 9.5kw battery but on a 8.2kw battery will only charge at 2600w, and I have a Gen1 which will only charge at 2600w whatever battery.
You're restricted by battery technology and firmware, I'm restricted by inverter technology and firmware.!
TimHutchings The current spec sheet for the 8.2 says 51V and 80A max charge/discharge current, ie 4kw – same as the 9.5. Perhaps older versions were more constrained.
TimHutchings it will charge at 3kw with an AC3..
Avenir yes, t&c clause 6 says it's designed for those with EV. Clause 7 says that you don't meet this eligibility criteria they can place you on a different tariff.
Unofficial wiki lists two versions of 8.2kWh batteries - 80% and 100% DoD - and both have max 4kW (ie limited by inverter).
Avenir I obviously remembered the 8.2 charge rate wrong - apologies for that. Do think the smaller batteries only charge at 2.6kw. Checking the latest data sheet for the 8.2kw battery, it has changed to 100% depth of discharge from 80% and a 12 year warranty too instead of 10.
Russ If you are with Octopus download the "Octopus Compare" app you can compare to tariffs at a time at 1 week/months for free.
To check tariffs for your area you can check energy-stats.uk and to make sure you get the right region the info is below
I assumed I was in south eastern england as im down bottom right on map but apparently im covered by Eastern England region.
Old tariff vs new, agile can be fun and great if you have battery.
For me agile is for most of day under flux for my area and im gonna get paid during the am today and even tomorrow if the 22:30 is any indication.
You could see on the compare app what flux is like then load up agile and go tariffs and see teh cost on those.
Jellybaby does octopus compare make adjustments to your usage on the assumption that you would change behaviour? Eg if you're on a flat tariff there's no reason to avoid usage in the early evening. But if you then ask what that would have cost on agile, it will result in a poor comparison, even if you had actually been on agile, you'd have shifted to avoid those peak times.
Guy Lipman (?) also has a web page that can do tariff comparisons.
Intelligent Octopus Go. Surely a no-brainer.
6 hrs off peak at 7.5p means only 18 hours on battery/ solar.
Charge batteries fully every night. Export any leftover at 15p.
In summer, same: charge batteries overnight to 100%, Export all solar and then export all battery before 23:30.
Check out “OctoAid” app. You can do comparisons with your actual use on that as well. When I compare IOG to any of the other tariffs it It’s about £150 cheaper. It’s a brilliant free app.
Pete UK Intelligent Octopus Go. Surely a no-brainer.
Obviously, if you qualify for it. Not all cars / chargepoints are supported. It's sufficiently attractive that it has finally persuaded me to get a compatible chargepoint installed.
DD
Can i get this tariff with just a suitable charger (I have panels, battery and Gen1 Hy5.0)
Do I need working smart meter as Octo still cant get smart meters working after 45 months and I am on preconfigured Eco7 meter.
SteveCook All smart tariffs require a smartmeter with (usually) 30-minute reporting. In principle, Go could be done by setting up the smartmeter to use two registers, like eco7, with appropriate switchover times, but they choose not to. (Doing so would also allow the IHD to actually display the correct pricing info.)
Octopus have created their "home mini" which gets the usage from the smartmeter over the local network (same mechanism as the IHD), and uploads it to Octopus over wifi. I think they might be hoping to use that as a solution for those whose smartmeters cannot connect over the air, but I don't know where they're getting with that. (Presumably there are all sorts of regulatory hurdles they have to overcome.)
DD Octopus Mini isn't to send data to Octopus to use, it's to replace the IHD in homes so consumers can track their usage in near real-time. Ofgem mandated real-time usage as part of the smart meter rollout, IHD was the obvious choice but then BG and Octopus were able to trial other ways and brought the data in their apps
Yep you need a working smart meter. I feel your pain. It took us almost 2 years to get ours working (when we were with SEE). Had 3 replacements till it finally worked.
Each smart meter worked for about 2 weeks then stopped. Then we had to wait months and months, do all the stupid self tests again, SSE engineer visits, then meter engineer visits etc etc then waited a few more months for the next replacement. The last time they replaced them they added an extra aerial onto the electric meter (even though it didn’t need it as the signal was strong!)
I think probably best for you to call Octopus, speak to a human, make a big fuss and just keep chasing it.
A working smart meter unlocks all the far better tariffs, so worth the hassle chasing them. A “45 month” wait is a very very long time though, unless that’s a typo.
WRT compatible chargers. It might be worth biting the bullet and replacing the head unit for a compatible one, even if you’re going to have to drop about £500 to replace it. Maybe Octopus have some deals on for compatible ones?? 🤷🏼♂️
Copy of my post elsewhere. Yes 45 months!
I am sure all these tariffs are great, but after 45 months Octopus still can't get my meters to be smart.
I have had every excuse under the sun and it is only because I was on the point of going to Ombudsman (offered £100 to not contact Ombudsman, but I declined) that finally things seem to have escalated rather than "wait another 3 months, send another "engineer" to fit new gas and electric meters" and hope they will work. I think I am on 12th set of meters! Aargh.
I am on fixed Eco7 import/export meter and have to take and submit readings each month.
Let's see what 2024 brings. Maybe that will fix the signal.
Cdent the mini sends the data to octopus. The app can view the data from the octopus servers. There's no way to access the data locally directly. (There's a newer model which may offer it locally via mqtt.)
There's a YouTube video about the mini, and they definitely talk about as an alternative transport for smart meter data when other Comms don't work.
DD Whatever the mini does is a moot point as Octopus currently will not supply them to customers. Nor do they have a date when that might change. Sounds like the "project" is dead to me.
Vestas
Mine was supplied to me just last month.
Unusually, I now have an Octopus Home Mini, a Hidebrand Glow CAD and a new IHD all gathering data from my meters and reporting it in various ways.
PianSom Did you have an IHD/SMETS2 meter already?
Curious because this is what my daughter is being told - she's missing an IHD as the previous owners (who weren't very bright) took it with them.
I have a gen 1 3.6 kWh inverter and a 9.5kwh battery.
I am on intelligent Go 11:30-5:30 and can fully charge my home battery between 01:30 and 05:30.
One thing no one really mentions is being able to plug your car in during the day and getting extra slots from Octopus. I only have a granny charger, so if it works out that I will struggle to charge during the normal time slot it will give me instant slots.
So if my home battery runs out early, like it did yesterday at 4.30pm, I can plug the car in and get extra slots all the way through until 11.30pm. Of course when this happens the whole house is billed at 7.5p as well.
Vestas
I had a working IHD. Then Octopus told me that I couldn't have a working OHM with my meter, so sent me a new IHD. Then sent me an OHM, which works fine with my meters.
Go figure.
I haven't looked, but I suspect my old IHD would still work. I was told by Hildebrand that the HAN will support 5 connected devices, including the gas meter.
PianSom Sounds like a normal utility company then in this regard, right hand doesn't know what the left is doing etc..
Thanks, I'll pass it on to her. Not sure she's that bothered anyway 🙂
Which cars do they not support? I'm looking into the Toyota Rav4 plug in hybrid. Would this car qualify?
Thanks for all the great info everyone.
DD It does not no but rarely has it been the flat tariff rate outside of peak times.
Russ There doesn't seem to be a list of compatible cars, but if you go to
https://octopus.energy/smart/intelligent-octopus-go/
you can go through the compatibilty check as a non-customer. (If you are already an Octopus customer, you can use a private window / different browser so it doesn't recognise you.)
Trying it now for RAV4 with 3-pin charger, I get
You do not have a car or charger that is ready for Intelligent Octopus yet
DD
The way I read this is you need a compatible car OR a compatible charger. Bottom line of page
I can't see where it says a combination of both,
SteveCook Correct, you need a compatible car or a compatible chargepoint. But when you go into the eligibility check, it will ask you what you have, and you have to tell it both before it will tell you whether either is compatible. Choosing 3-pin plug forced it to base the check on the car.
DD
So i guess I buy a £1000ish compatible charger, and tell it a fictitious car model that I own!
Any suggested combination of the above to get me through the registration process?
NB Octo still have to get the meters smart after 45 months so it is a bit academic right now
SteveCook That would, of course, be fraud.
Note that they generally require a test charge before they will let you onto the tariff, so that they can verify that they have full control over the charging process.
DD Note that they generally require a test charge before they will let you onto the tariff, so that they can verify that they have full control over the charging process.
That is not true if you have a compatible charger. Or, at least, it is not true if you have a Zappi.
PianSom Yeah, I wasn't going to mention that... They do also expect you to charge regularly, but I have no idea whether they actually check that - I lot of people just say that they disable smart charging and use it as a better/cheaper Go.
Yeah, it looks like to me you only need get the charger. I may get that ordered and then see if I'm able to switch to the Go tariff. I'll be buying a plug in hybrid in the next month or so anyway.
Cheers
Do you have to get a charger from Octopus to get the Go Tariff?
When you say expect to use it, is that in the terms and conditions? Of course if I get a plug in hybrid Rav 4 I will be using it so sounds like it would be okay.
Russ I've heard various interpretations, and the T&C change and are not always up to date. (I think some places mention that only Ohme chargepoint is supported.)
In the faq, "how do I sign up" does say a test charge is required. (Step 4).
I don't see anything in the current terms about using it regularly, but I think there was reference to at least one smart charge per 6 weeks. Terms do say you must tell them up your charging requirements, and you give them permission to control the charging. But I don't immediately see anything about requiring charging. Indeed current wording implies it is sufficient to simply give them control of a chargepoint.
Chargepoint doesn't have to be installed by Octopus (though their prices do seem pretty competitive.)
Yeah, good reason no one is mentioning it.
I don’t really think this is how they intend their off-peak intelligent charging tariff to be used. And kind of ‘possibly’, ‘probably’, ‘definitely’ may be considered by them to be abusing the fair usage policy in the T&C’s by slow charging your car the whole day during the peak rates and only paying the super off peak price on everything including the whole house.
Lots of talk of “gaming the system” like this has been discussed a lot in other forums. They do have the right to kick you off the tariff for doing this sort of thing, so be very wary and maybe don’t do it too often if you want to stay on the tariff.
I know it’s possible and the odd person does it but ultimately you’ll likely get kicked off the tariff at some point in the future if you abuse it like this, or worse, they’ll withdraw the tariff or enforce much stricter rules for everyone else. I’m sure they’ll be monitoring this sort of stuff and if/ when it starts to cost them too much they’ll take action and make “some changes”.
It’s a great tariff, so I’d hate to see it removed. As others have said in other forums, please don’t abuse it and spoil it for everyone else.
Good luck.
Pete UK I’m not necessarily gaming the system as my charger is usually charging between 1kwh and 2kwh hour max.
Obviously their system has discerned that this is not impacting their peak load. I was only charging the car and covering house load.
Taking the day I mentioned as an example my usage from 4.30pm until midnight was 21.5kwh. My cooking had already been done and my heating and water is covered by gas.
Most I pulled was 3.4 kWh which is probably because it kicked in during the 30 min segment of the oven being on. The rest was mainly 2kwh for the car, which is exactly the use io is intended for. I have no idea what would happen if I had a 7kwh charger. I presume it would work out I had enough charge to use the 11.30-5.30 charge. I would use far more energy in that scenario.
I don’t need a faster charger as my work charger is currently free.
Russ There are certain chargers that are compatible with io.
Try https://octopus.energy/get-an-ev-charger/ with the combination of your EV. Ohme usually work quite well from what I’ve seen. Before I bought my Tesla, I was looking at the polestar 2 and the Ohme home pro would have been my choice.
However now the zappi is on the list, that would be my choice no questions asked.
Hook have you had any problems with Intelligent and your Tesla? Mine occasionally just doesn’t work. Plug in make a schedule and then nothing. Just a message saying “we can’t control your device “ . Octopus have been very slow.
Only once where I had a 10.30pm slot last Friday before going to the airport at 2am. As I needed it to be at 100% I checked 10 mins after and manually started it in the end.
But I had just done a software update. I presume any issues are always going to be linked to comms. Usually the car is connected via WiFi at home.
I have noticed a charge stop an hour early with that message though. But I don’t regularly charge everyday. Maybe 2/3 times a week.
Maybe they reason that because the rate you are drawing is “low” over the peak period (expensive times) it doesn’t cost them too much extra and allow it because on average it’s not costing them too much extra ~ or any extra? It’s possibly that. Possibly they don’t monitor it too closely yet. Or possibly as it’s a beta tariff they are still monitoring all the users and data. 🤷🏼♂️
2kW an hour from 16:30pm till 23:30 is still 14kW (or 21.5kW including the house) though… 🤔
Perhaps if it was 50kW+ (using a heat pump, charging home batteries, and other cars at the same time on full pelt etc) they’d take a bit more interest.
Be nice if the rest of us got that for cheap as well. (I’m just jealous 😂😂). Although I could be doing the same using a granny charger, I’m not.
Luckily my batteries are holding out till 23:30 so far this time of year, so running out hasn’t become an issue for me yet.
Hook if I ever get an answer from Octopus I’ll post it. Tesla found nothing wrong, nor did Hypervolt. WiFi to the car seems ok updates etc work fine.
Pete UK
Hi I don't want to abuse it (don't even have working smart meters yet), but I am trying to understand how/why people who have a battery in an EV can get cheaper electricity than someone with battery storage in a house when they essentially do the same thing.
Also I might buy an EV, sell it/crash it/get stolen etc after 3 months. Do I then have an obligation to tell Octo and switch my tariff?
My daughter in law has an EV and she and husband regularly come and stay. Can I put this type of car down?
EV’s use way more juice than house batteries- at least for normal people. And charge all year. Before solar batteries etc the house used 3/3500kw and the car 2500. The house battery looks like it will use about 600 from the grid ( haven’t had it long enough for full figures yet). We do 8-10k miles so anyone doing more would use more, especially if not a Tesla…so I guess Octopus just want high users
SimonClarke
Thanks, I get that ,but do the T&Cs define any parameters of min rate and amount consumed/month etc.
What about the point of loss/sale of car?
I haven’t seen any consumption rates but in my case I had to have a compatible car as the fairly useless Hypervolt charger doesn’t talk to Octopus ( or me sometimes). Perhaps someone should ask them. If they ever answer…Probably just ticking boxes
I have a friend that has an EV and has built his own large battery that just plugs into a 13A socket plus a few PV panels in his garden. I think he gets all his electricity at the cheap EV rate plus some free from the panels, which he can angle as the seasons change.
SteveCook Hi I don't want to abuse it (don't even have working smart meters yet), but I am trying to understand how/why people who have a battery in an EV can get cheaper electricity than someone with battery storage in a house when they essentially do the same thing.
I do agree. I'm on Go tariff (I do have an EV), but at the moment mileage is fairly low, so I feel a little guilty that most of the cheap electricity I'm using at the moment is for the house battery, not the car, whereas, as you say, people with just a house battery have to pay more.
The intention with Intelligent Octopus is that you give Octopus full control of your car charging. That's why they are offering better rates than standard Go. Yet people talk about turning off smart charging and just using it as a better Go. So I guess I feel similarly frustrated - because I have a Leaf, I "only" get Go rates, whereas my neighbour can have Intelligent Go, just because he has a different model of EV. Even if he doesn't actually let Octopus control the charging.
The actual T&C, however, are pretty vague. Looks like it's written by someone to whom it wouldn't occur that anyone might try to find loopholes. Not helped by the fact that they've merged the terms for Intelligent Go and Intelligent Flux. One clause they have added recently is the fair-use bit - only guaranteeing 6 managed charging slots per 24 hours.
"2.4.1.3 The Intelligent Octopus tariff is for customers with a battery electric vehicle or plug-in hybrid vehicle that charges primarily at the home that we supply." If you sell your EV, that would appear to make you ineligible. But Octopus are unlikely to enforce it.
"2.4.1.5 To be eligible for this tariff, you agree to download the Octopus Energy app and register your low carbon technology on the app. This is an ongoing requirement throughout your time on this tariff. If at any time you do not have an active authorisation for integration with a supported vehicle or charge point and you have not had such active authorisation for a period of more than 30 days, you will no longer be eligible for this tariff and we will switch you to one of our fairly priced standard tariffs and you will be billed according to your usage under that tariff." would also seem to disqualify you if you're using one of the car integrations, since you can't reasonably maintain access to the car's API after you sell it.
I’m not sure exactly what’s in Octopus’s minds but I’m certain they are buying their electricity wholesale much much cheaper than 7.5p between 23:30 and 05:30, so would like to sell as much as possible between those hours. EV’s use quite a lot. In my case it’s about 20-25% of the annual house use. But for others it may be way over 50%+ There is (some?) competition between suppliers out there for selling this cheap overnight electricity to EV owners (for a profit). How they gain this business is up to the tariffs they offer and how they decide to market it.
Maybe they can make more profit margin per kW (or on total volume) in these hours than at more expensive times?
As for why EV’s and not just battery owners,
No idea.
WRT what happens if your car gets stolen. No idea. I’d worry about it only if/when it happens. I’m sure they’d be reasonable.
When I signed up I think the requirements were:
1) own an an EV that’s compatible. OR own an EV and have a compatible charger.
2) under 15,000kW use per year (IIRC).
3) smart charge at least once per month.
Some on other forums have reported getting emails asking why they didn’t smart charge within the last 30 days (they were on holiday). But they explained and it was accepted.
Whether you can register with someone else’s car… well, you’re not supposed to. Maybe they check the registered address on the cars V5, maybe not. Maybe not yet? 🤷🏼♂️
I watched a Youtube video the other day about car manufacturers and APIs and a couple have pulled them as it costs the manufacturer a lot of data processing and facilities to keep sending data for something they are no longer receiving income from. Particularly if the car is now 2nd hand onwards.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjbqG2q44zw&ab_channel=NicolasRaimo
SteveCook Yes. I think another objected to people giving a third party (Octopus) access to their account - T&C said it was for personal use only, and passwords must not be shared.
Kia support seems to come and go - the problem is that each time they query the car, it activates circuits that drain the 12V battery, and it turned out to be a problem. Not sure if the circuits stayed active for longer than expected, or something. Chargepoint integration feels like the safer route.
I saw the same video but apart from Ford it sounded like guessing (as a Tesla owner I hope so!). I might turn off the smart charge part soon if Octopus can’t sort the problem I have and as I have fulfilled their requirements I assume it will carry on. Need charging to be reliable.
DD one of the issues I’ve had is that after plugging in it just carries on charging at peak rates
Pete UK I’m not sure exactly what’s in Octopus’s minds but I’m certain they are buying their electricity wholesale much much cheaper than 7.5p between 23:30 and 05:30, so would like to sell as much as possible between those hours.
Agile is probably a reasonably good proxy for how much it costs to supply electricity at different times of day. Sometimes it's cheap overnight, but not always. (Sometimes it even goes -ve.) And not always in those particular time slots, but on average, those slots are probably cheap.
But I think the point is that Octopus want to be in control of the actual charging timing - it gives them control of a large virtual power sink that they can offer as a resource to the national grid, to soak up power when it's available in excess and greenest. ie they can try to match it to when the wind is blowing. It's cheaper to pay Octopus to consume excess energy than it is to pay windfarms to curtail their generation.
Similar to the savings sessions, in reverse : it's presumably cheaper to pay £3/kWh for energy saved than to fire up an expensive power plant when supply is running short. We are acting as a sort of virtual power generator.
SimonClarke My understanding of how it works is that Octopus are supposed to notice quickly, and tell the car to stop until a better time. When they are controlling the car, rather than the chargepoint, the chargepoint has to be left in a dumb mode so that it's always ready to supply power when the car asks for it. It's possible that the Tesla's events are such that it can only notify when charging actually starts, not just when the car is plugged in.
I believe Tesla can control charging power: in principle, Octopus could leave it in a low-power config after charging, so that next time, it draws only a low rate when you plug in, until it notices and stops the charge. But that might be annoying when you go to do public charging, for example.
I've heard that you can just use the API (Tesla app ?) to tell the car to stop - Octopus will still be aware that the car is plugged in, and so can still schedule charging.
I think with the Zappi integration, on the other hand, the chargepoint is left in a state that it won't charge when the car is plugged in, but tells Octopus the car is now attached and ready to be charged.
DD yes they are supposed to notice and stop the charge but it often runs for a noticeable amount of time, once till it was full, so I now always turn it off via the car. Octopus are aware of this. Whether they care I don’t know. Very rarely use public charging but I can guarantee low power charging would be potentially very annoying if you can’t control it yourself.
So the first thing I do when I plug my car in is go the app and tell it to stop charging.
When Octopus send you the charging slots it will begin to charge the car between the times set in their app.
Sometimes it may take 20 mins or so, so you don’t want to be on peak rate waiting.
Also whatever slot it gives you, it will apply to the full 30 mins of that slot.
I only let the Octopus app control my car’s charging at home. I don’t manually do it.
Hook it doesn’t give a slot for the initial plug in and they charge at peak rate - another thing I am “discussing “ with them. Owe me a good tenner from last month.
The only manual control I use is stop charging on the Tesla app.
DD But I think the point is that Octopus want to be in control of the actual charging timing - it gives them control of a large virtual power sink that they can offer as a resource to the national grid, to soak up power when it's available in excess and greenest. ie they can try to match it to when the wind is blowing.
Octopus also have 200MW of Biomass plants in the UK so I suspect a lot of the cheap overnight rate is atleast partially subsidised by those when the wind isn't blowing (7 sites scattered around the UK)
They are starting to clamp down on people using all day to charge the car and get cheap rate all day.
Read the “WiKi: Everything you wanted to know about Intelligent Octopus but were afraid to ask” on the Tesla forum UK. Most of the useful stuff is in the first post.
TLDR; to stop the car charging continuously for an extended period at peak when you first plug in: (/and also to stop the home batteries from discharging into the car).
1) set the off peak end time to 05:30 in the car
2) set the ready-by time to 05:30 in the Octopus app.
3) If you have solar batteries: set your home battery to charge between 23:30 and 05:30.
when you plug it in it won’t charge at all during peak time. 👍🏻
modify timings above on the rare occasions you get any slots outside of the core 6 hours 23:30-05:30. (This might happen in our case if we arrive with less than 23% SOC in the car (we charge to 80%)
this is “set and forget” and works perfectly for us and without modifying/ or having the burden of pressing the “stop charge” button in the car app every time you plug in.
Hope that helps.
There is also an alternative way by setting your cars start charge time to 23:30. But I don’t like that as much, as I’m asleep if any of the slots change !
Whereas, I’m awake when I plug the car in (usually)
Pete UK unfortunately Octopus thinks that’s cheating. But it also doesn’t make any difference
Cheating? - I seriously doubt it mate. Cheating is when you try to get all day cheap power !
You literally select when your ready-by time is in the octopus app. It’s user selectable and you select it. They even say “tell us when you want the car ready by”.
Also it’s within the guaranteed 6 hours off peak.
Why would you say “Octopus thinks that’s cheating” ? - they don’t ! Makes no sense 🤷🏼♂️
Those settings do work 100%. Set like that, yes it does solve your problem. If they aren’t working for you there is some other reason, like a mistake or perhaps something else controlling the car like a third party app interferring, the API, home assistant or the charger. Maybe post up here what integrations your using and a screenshot of your settings so we can check.
Just trying to help. Go read first post of the wiki. Pretty much every question is asked and answered (usually over and over again by people not bothering to read the first post 😂!)
Pete UK sorry misunderstood thought you meant setting the car to control the time
No worries
I actually think it's wrong to only offer these tariffs to people with EVs. Many people would also benefit from the cheaper electricity at night, and most people with EVs are already fairly well off.
Does octopus know when you are charging your car?
Russ no, not on standard Go tariff. With IOG you should schedule charging through their system (or Ohme), but they wouldn't know if you just manually charge overnight, or from excess solar.
(Well... for a chargepoint-based integration, they might have access to all charging records, whether scheduled or otherwise. Maybe also some car integrations - don't know. Though probably couldn't distinguish home charging from public charging, so I guess not.)
They know when they are charging it with IOG.
The whole idea with IOG is that they pick the cheapest/ greenest half hour overnight slots to use and you pay a fixed low price but both parties benefit, rather than just one continuous charge from cheap and not-so-cheap power (where only the customer benefits!). Meaning it’s way cheaper for them. Which in return, is passed on to the customer by way of a lower fixed off peak rate compared to non-smart tariffs.
It’s still a Beta tariff, and I guess they are still assessing who’s using it as intended, who isn’t, who’s making them money, and who is ‘taking advantage’(?) and costing them money. It’s not just an extended hour regular GO tariff. There are pro’s and cons to it as well. But using it as intended should work well for both supplier and customer. They have other non-smart tariffs but they aren’t as cheap because they don’t have the flexibility of IOG to balance the grid and use only the cheapest half hour slots (everyone just plugs in at the same time and all the charging starts at the off-peak start time together no mater what the suppliers price per kW is!)
With just solar batteries and no EV, would IOG work well? Would you be ok with your solar batteries having multiple charge slots? Maybe not completely charging them every morning? Having them discharge in between slots? Also, how do you handle that with your battery app? How would Octopus control them?
Sure you can use HA - but I bet that’s too complex for 95% of the population. Octopus get the benefit from controlling the devices attached. Don’t think controlling a few smaller capacity devices would benefit them as much as the much larger capacity of a car battery.
I think them specifying only smart charging once a month is reasonably generous to be honest. I use the tariff and I’m not sure why you’d want to not smart charge but some have had teething problems and for whatever other reasons decide to do that more often than not.
killythebid The night rate has now dropped to 6.9p. I've recently moved over from Octopus Intelligent Go. Also I believe this tariff is available even if you don't have an EV and just have batteries, unlike Intelligent Go.
Rahul Yes indeed but I posted the text you replied to in Dec 2023 so a while ago now. They do allow people to join with a domestic battery but no EV.
The SEG agreement has rolled over now and I have been paid but thus far I am sticking with EON as with all considered it just tips in EON's favour over the equivilant Octopus tariff's or its it almost the same.
That may be different of course for others who use thir system diffently to me.