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#1 Daveb01
Just seen this
New GE products on ENA Register
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#3 hoggy
They (GE/JMHing) used to make inverters for other people (I've mentioned a few relations on here before)
They had stopped but guess they are starting again.
Polar-ESS is in the same building in China as GE from those docs.
Potentially it's a sneak peak at Gen4? The docs show 5kW+ battery charge/discharge.
Albeit if the images are correct will be no good for outdoors as isolator is on the side / casing full of holes & presumably fans.
#4 PianSom
#5 hoggy
PianSom no this is something else, a new brand, seemingly made by GE that appears to run 51.2V rack type batteries.
https://www.polar-ess.com/Content/2443089.html
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#6 kram
Well there is the 3.68 version of the AIO and another entry NI, there is a 16A, 3 phase (again g98).
The polar east 4.6 looks like it’s at the German equivalent of g98. Wonder if polar ess is a German sub brand.
3.68, 5/4.68 and 6kW hybrids.
#7 hoggy
No idea, looks very China based to me.
You can pick one up on alibaba it seems
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Polar-ESS-Polar-ESS-3kw-5kw_1600922871929.html
#8 Hook
I wish they would concentrate on their current products rather than rushing other models to market.
The saying walk before you run would come to mind. I see the current AIO users are having a hard time still. I have a gen 1 hybrid inverter and have given up on the new firmware that was being promised.
Fortunately my system works well and the 3rd party support that has grown up around the products is giving us extra functionality.
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#9 Al E.Gator
Hook Couldn't agree more with this. When I got my system there was just the AC3, Hybrid, and a selection of batteries. Now you have, 3.6kW hybrid, 5kW hybrid, AC3, AIO, EVC, Selection of batteries and all the commercial side. Many of which still have serious issues. Perhaps just focusing on the Hybrid and an AC coupled system with a couple of batteries to choose from and making them as good as they can possibly be would be better. I feel like already GE are starting to abandon original for equipment that is supposed to last >15 years. Doesn't bode well for if your Inverter breaks in 15 years and GE are no longer supporting the product line resulting in a paper weight of a battery.
#10 hoggy
I'll have a rummage tonight when I get back home, these don't "feel" very givenergy like the rest. Not sure what or who they are aimed at, kind of look a bit Sunsynk / Deye with the isolator on the side, but don't look tall enough to be identical.
#11 hoggy
A little sleuthing, and I have some theories but not sure yet.
Couple of things, on their Alibaba site they have a virtual factory tour - which is just full of Givenergy Gear (AIO's in various states of build, piles of AIO batteries, a few inverters & a mound of AIO Gateways)
This ALPS Hybrid thing seems to have been around 5 months according to their linkedin page. So not new. There is a video on there which shows (presumably) Givenergy internal software & what looks like a Gen 2 2.6kWh battery that uses those orange connectors like the 9.5kWh packs.
What I am not a fan of, is (hopefully not genuine but looks pretty genuine to me) customer portal data splashed across their Alibaba page from the portal. Do they have access to this data too? (IVolts and E.on being the standout there)
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#12 kram
hoggy
I meant targeted at the DE regulations, not made it DE👍
IANAL, but if that owner data has left the UK/EU without the appropriate permissions, that could be a GDPR problem.
#13 hoggy
kram think my post has been deleted/hidden... can't see it now.
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#14 Al E.Gator
hoggy Yes it has… that’s concerning
#15 hoggy
Al E.Gator Well that was a waste of time then. Least I'm not imagining things.
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#16 Rubikcube
Just wondering if hoggy has special status, or if anyone can get their posts deleted.
Further information on the data protection issue mentioned in the deleted post, although the portal front end is hosted on AWS, the database behind it is hosted on ALICLOUD. Polar ESS seem to have full access to both.
#17 PianSom
hoggy
Are the Aliexpress images you posted still up?
#18 hoggy
I'm not aware of any special status, beyond perhaps being internally labelled as some sort of annoyance / PITA.
I'm not sure which half caused upset, the factory tour or the portal parts - it wasn't like I was flying a drone through their factory window, it's literally just there on Linkedin/Twitter/Alibaba page...
If GE want to make some sort of budget/Dacia Sandero range of inverters, I don't really care - it's their kit, it would be naïve to think that someone wouldn't notice ENA adding it and simply google the inverter as "ooo what's this shiny new GE thing."
I don't personally understand the business case for certifying it for sale/connection in the UK and competing against...yourself (see also, British Leyland) nor do I quite grasp the considerable effort going into CEMS if you had a high powered Hybrid up your sleeve all along negating most of the need for plant setups.
As for the portal, I have worked with the portal guys for years picking up on "things" I won't & shall never disclose in regards to security, with no gesture in return, occasionally at my expense (which is fine, it was my spare time and an experience building.) but to then see that potentially undone by what I hope at best is/was a graphic designers mock up of the portal with unfortunate use of real user data & at worst I guess a full on clone of the portal with a set of crayons to make it green not blue - to a company I've never heard of - does feel like I've perhaps wasted my time.
It wasn't catastrophically bad data shown but does open the door to awkward questions as to who has access to what.
I'll leave it at that, and see if this one stays up!
#19 hoggy
I give up: https://polar-ess.co.uk/
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#20 Al E.Gator
hoggy Their mobile app looks identical to GE, even the same colour scheme.
#21 hoggy
Al E.Gator its because it turns out it is GE's new economy brand. (Which doesn't forgive all in regards to the CN alibaba page data thing) but atleast fills in a few blanks.
Not sure what you forgo installing it, as the app /portal appears to have the same features. Presumably has an API. Can probably self install batteries and it has better charge rates it's an odd one.
I guess they are going 2 tiered (cheap cheerful Polar) OR Giv is going pure HV and Polar take the LV stuff. (Given AIO & new 3 phase inverters are HV batteries it's not a massive leap to assume the next single phase Giv ones are HV only instead)
#22 PianSom
Al E.Gator
Ah, but - “Plus limited time launch offer: full app access for the first 12 months”
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#23 Al E.Gator
PianSom Ahh so a paid portal monitoring scheme
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#24 Al E.Gator
hoggy You would have thought Giv are going to need to support LV stuff for many many more years for all the existing customers who might need a replacement battery/inverter to keep their system going.
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#25 Rubikcube
If you go right down to the footer of https://polar-ess.co.uk/
and click on Privacy Policy ...
it takes you to the givenergy website and gives a 404 error.
Clearly quality stuff, built and tested with care and attention to detail :-/
#26 hoggy
Al E.Gator depends how you define support, you could support with spare parts and not release anything else new in LV above Gen3 I guess. Just a feeling I've got seeing where the rest of the range has gone.
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#27 kram
That’s going to cause some headaches if any EU owners had there data sent there…
As for the name… I mean it could be an economy brand, it could be a new name for consumer products, it could be to get around some reputation damage, it could be to take the business as an old one is folded.
Only time will tell.
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#28 kram
So portal is chargeable and they come with a three years warranty. Some borderline cells that are ok, but might cause headaches could be making it through.
3 years warranty and no monitoring is an ideal hiding place. 😂 Joke just to be clear.
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#29 geoffreycoan
kram there are plenty of battery inverter systems that don’t have portals so makes sense to turn this into a subscription value-add service.
Personally if they provide local API’s then I wouldn’t miss the portal. The data is only sampled not real-time and the graphs are wrong so I hardly ever use it - other than to reset the inverters when they occasionally get corrupted.
I see the 5.2 battery is 92% DoD. They look very similar to Plyontec. If they are self-installable then that’ll be a real bonus.
Be interesting to see how they do. Clearly GE recognise there is room for price differentiation in the marketplace
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#30 kram
I don’t disagree, but at that point I’ll take the pylontech devices as they are extremely well proven.
#31 hoggy
Unless my browser is playing up I believe the alibaba store header no longer shows Giv data now, so someone is scrubbing it in the background. Your welcome Giv/Polar...
#32 PianSom
hoggy
It is, at least, nice to know that GE actually read these posts!
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#33 Daveb01
Oh am I in trouble now for bringing this up, do I need to:
Go and see the headmaster
Get everyone a beer
😀👍🍺🍺
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#34 geoffreycoan
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#35 Daveb01
It’s interesting they are doing a 6 kw Inverter. This would be a better choice for loads of people if they did this for GEN 4 going forward.
I have a SolarEdge 6 kw inverter with an AIO (6000w) so this works well.
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#37 hoggy
Vestas I await my invitation to Giv HQ to take a look around their new GivDungeon such you'll never hear from me again...
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#38 Adam-Reynolds
hoggy you're always welcome 😄 !
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#39 Smk82
Daveb01 annoying they aren’t doing a 6kw AC inverter standalone for the low voltage setup. Or a standalone backwards compatible gateway.
Everything seems to be hybrid these days🤔
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#40 Daveb01
I agree, GE should bring out a single phase 6 & 7 kWh inverter now, as panels are getting higher ratings e.g 500 kw. (Mine are 440 kw)and I have 18.
I went with a SolarEdge for this reason and got a 6 kWh inverter that can go 150% - 200% above its rating, and the GE AIO (6000w export).
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#41 Daveb01
Looks like they are all compliant now.
#42 hoggy
Presumably you can run these as AC coupled by just nIt connecting PV to them (like you can the other GE hybrids)
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#43 Daveb01
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#45 Smk82
Daveb01 in my case, I could then have a 6kw discharge to house via EPS and with only a single inverter it would remove plant mode issues..
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#46 Daveb01
New Video out
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#48 kram
Yes, but in Germany there is a limit a bit like our g98 for solar connections. G98 is I think 16A per phase or 3.68kW. I believe the German limit is around 4.6kW or 20A.
Anyway my point was at the time maybe it was a solar brand from GE for Germany, but now it’s clear it is just an economy sub brand.
No skin off my nose as I don’t own any GE, although I was seriously considering it at the time and tried a few times. Still keep an eye on it in case friends/family go that route.