Fire detection choices

Hi all,

Thinking back to the new guidance discussed here.

I'm looking at putting a fire detector of some sort in our garage where our battery lives.
I had to add some radio-linked ones elsewhere in the house a few years back when the regs changed in Scotland, so I'm familiar enough with adding them in to our existing set. But the question is: for this kind of battery, should there be any incident, which type of detector would be most appropriate?

• optical smoke alarm?
• ionisation smoke alarm?
• heat alarm?
• some combination?
  Or is it simply a case of "it doesn't really matter what kind, just get one"...?

Cheers,
Jo

Heat feels like the sensible option, but there are going to be wider factors including the temperature threshold.

I’d be asking a professional for advice tbh and I am not in that field.

I have fitted a smoke alarm where the inverter and batteries are in our attic. I can't remember what type it is but nothing more than a straightforward domestic unit you might find on the landing etc. The only sophistication is that there is a repeater alarm downstairs so it can be heard better should it go off.

I would just get one of any type if that gives you peace of mind.

kram Heat feels like the sensible option, but there are going to be wider factors including the temperature threshold.

From personal experience of having had a kitchen fire, DO NOT GET A HEAT DETECTOR ALARM

When our house was extended we had to have interlinked smoke alarms. In the kitchen the builders fitted a heat alarm "so that you don't get unnecessary alarms from cooking"

Then when we had a fire in our kitchen that melted the insides of the extractor fan, lot of smoke damage, the heat alarm didn't go off. And as the door was shut no-one knew about it until the damage had been done.

(Insurance claim job)

I looked into the specification of the heat alarm and found that it would go off only when the heat was above 60 degrees. Bear in mind the heat alarm (per the building regulations) was on the ceiling, not directly above the cooker, there'd have to be a big raging fire for it to go off.

I swapped it for a smoke alarm. We have had a couple of burnt toast occasions when the room has genuinely had smoke in it and the alarms all go off, but never any alarms from just cooking. Am very cynical about heat alarms as a result of this experience. Read the specifications and be aware of what its limitations are

Keep in mind that manufacturers will recommend heat alarms for areas like garages, lofts and utility areas where there might be dust or humidity. If your garage can get damp or dusty you may have to deal with false detections from some types.

We have installed something very like this in our loft where our inverters and batteries are. https://www.fireangel.co.uk/home/product/fp1720w2-r/

From what I understand with that model it is rapid change in temperature rather than absolute temperature that triggers.

AICO do a range of detectors that can be mains powered with an internal battery backup. They can also take a wireless module to talk to other AICO devices so that if one goes off, they all go off.
I fitted a smoke in my loft room above the inverter/battery and if that goes it sounds others in the house whereas I would not hear my loft one on its own if i was in bed

Josephiah Optical smoke alarm would be my choice.

Ionisation ones have a fixed lifespan (5-10 years) from manufacture as the radioactive isotope decays so if you go for one of those then check the dates before you buy.

Heat alarm is inappropriate for LiFePO4 batteries, they can catch fire but there's a lot more smoke than heat to start with.

Is the garage integral to the house? If so I thought that Scottish building regs mandated an alarm in there anyway?

It does also rather depend on whether you use the garage for an ICE car as well - smoke alarms might activate from the exhaust gases....

The only advice really anyone should give is

• Ask the local fire officer in your area for recommendations
• find a electrician on the part p register

My advice for leaving large storage batteries and BEV's when on holiday
leave batteries with a max SOC of 50%
set any charge to a maximum of 50%

geoffreycoan DO NOT GET A HEAT DETECTOR ALARM

SteveCook AICO do a range of detectors that can be mains powered with an internal battery backup. They can also take a wireless module to talk to other AICO devices so that if one goes off, they all go off.

Yes, our house had hardwired AICO ionisation smoke detectors in the kitchen, hall and landing when we moved in. At the regs change in 2020/21 I renewed those, added a wireless base, and added optical and heat detectors in the kitchen (pretty sure getting both was a requirement). So will add additional wireless ones in the garage, and probably in our utility room too, as we're doing a lot more timed/overnight appliance runs these days since switching to Agile.

Vestas Optical smoke alarm would be my choice.
...
Heat alarm is inappropriate for LiFePO4 batteries, they can catch fire but there's a lot more smoke than heat to start with.

Is the garage integral to the house? If so I thought that Scottish building regs mandated an alarm in there anyway?

Ah, this is what I wanted to know, and should have thought through more specifically before asking! I may be wrong, but don't remember the garage one being a requirement. But seems a sensible step now we have a load more active electrical stuff in there.

Thanks all, I'm thinking probably one of these for the garage and another for the utility room.

killythebid Its against regulations to install solar equipment in the loft now for safety reasons apparently. Regs recently changed.

Josephiah The dual sensor one is a good choice as the optical may false alarm if you use the garage for a ICE car.

I think that's what is going to be mandated soon for integral garages in E&W, regardless of whether there is an internal door or not. It'd be a sensible change to the regs given how much flammable stuff there is in a garage which has been in use for a while, especially since there's almost invariably a bedroom above it.

I think it is against draft recommendations rather than specifically regulations. I am pretty relaxed about our wall mounted system being up there, which was in any case installed before this. Floor stood would worry me more - one of the major concerns was a 63kg battery dropping on first responders through a fire compromised ceiling.

If in doubt consult your qualified installer of course.

UKEZ Not yet it has been recommended only so far in proposed changes.

Personally, I do not see the problem with an attic installation done well. In my case the units are attached to a 2ft thick wall with a steel shelf below them also attached to said wall. The units will not fall through the ceiling in case of a fire. The only way they will come down is if the wall itself comes down and if it does there are more and much heavier things to worry about than the equipment falling on you.

I also do not have any high-temperature issues. In fact, our attic space gets no hotter than the garage (separate building) and is warmer on the whole in winter.

pwdst You wont have to worry about the first responders, If those things drop on them they wont feel a thing..

Josephiah We have aico interlinked alarms as per holyrood regs, and battery in the loft (installed two days before cut-off date) and now have a linked aico multi-sensor alarm (heat and optical smoke) up there. No false alarms so far!

Iain

As with @killythebid the batteries and inverters are securely mounted to the thick party wall with our neighbours. If they are coming down then the entire property is coming down, possibly along with a large chunk of the neighbouring properties. If it gets to that point then hopefully the first responders have long since evacuated the neighbours and retreated to a defensive posture. The floor stood portable air conditioning unit on the first floor would actually worry me more in the early stages of a fire.