!Please be aware! AIO and Gateway install likely does not comply with BS7671

The GivEnergy Gateway AIO system is marketed as a device designed for installation between the grid supply and a standard domestic electrical installation.

During an on-site test, the prospective short-circuit current of a GivEnergy AIO system was measured at 165A.

Consider the following installation:
-The domestic consumer unit is connected to the grid via the AIO.
-A BS EN 60898 B40 MCB is installed to protect a cooker circuit.
-BS 7671 requires that in a TT installation, a standard domestic circuit must disconnect within 0.2 seconds in the event of a fault.
-Manufacturer trip curves suggest that a B40 MCB requires a fault current exceeding 200A to achieve disconnection within 0.2 seconds.
-In the event of a grid failure the AIO switches to island mode (TT earthing arrangement).
-At 165A fault current, the disconnection time exceeds the 0.2-second requirement.
-This indicates that the protection requirements of BS 7671 are not met, particularly for circuits protected by B40 MCBs, and other common MCB ratings, and especially for rewireable fuses, which are still present in some installations.

When questioned about this, GivEnergy technical support confirmed the findings but stated that it is the installer's responsibility to ensure compliance with BS 7671.

Despite repeated requests over the past months, GivEnergy has not provided the necessary technical details to assess whether the AIO and Gateway can be installed in full compliance with BS 7671.

Conclusion:
Without sufficient technical information from the manufacturer, it is not possible to confidently install this equipment while ensuring compliance with BS 7671. Installers should be aware of this limitation before proceeding with any installation.

What are the consequences of it being non-compliant with BS 7671? House cannot be sold?

This would equally apply to any off-grid installation, such as a Tesla Powerwall or a diesel generator.

Not a GivEnergy problem.

Counter argument:- How quickly does an AIO/Gateway installation trip when it is shorted?

50Hz Consider the following installation:
-The domestic consumer unit is connected to the grid via the AIO.

Hi yah, I am not sure you are fully correct in all installation cases.

The new GW does not have any RCBO/RCD’s etc in the device, it is up to your installer to source these now.

The Gen 1 GW does have RCBO/RCD’s. The RCD’s are for the PV system and AIO only. The power from the grid to the GW & the GW to the home are all on RCBO’s.

I do not have a cooker installed onto the GW, the kitchen circuit is via the main CU which has all RCBO’s (no RCD’s)

My installer removed the 2 x RCD’s and replaced them with RCBO’s, so my GW does not have any RCD’s.

Your not correct with the above, the CU is not connected to the grid via the AIO, it is connected via the GW.

It is a requirement to have an Earthing pole fitted for when there is a grid outage.

My installer tested a grid failure switch over of the GW before he signed it off and it was within the requirements. He also tested there was no power at all going back to the grid side of the GW.

Rubikcube

https://energylibrary.tesla.com/docs/Public/EnergyStorage/Powerwall/2/InstallManual/BackupGateway/2/en-us/GUID-D55C0267-8B08-4419-8D74-FE95867127E3.html

Gateway2 can deal with up to 10kVA…
What am I missing/ makes you certain it can’t comply?

[unknown] I am not an electrician but I think you are misinterpreting the 0.2s requirement, which is for tripping under Earth Fault conditions.

See this NICEIC document https://dms.niceic.com/0000003345.pdf (snippet quoted below)

The purpose of ADS is to ensure that, in the
event of a fault of negligible impedance between
a line conductor and an exposed-conductive-part
or protective conductor, the protective device
will automatically disconnect the circuit within
the appropriate disconnection times of Chapter
41 of BS 7671.

I have a 40A RCBO in my Consumer Unit supplying my 10.8kW Electric Shower, which in theory draws 49A. I contested this with the electrician when he upgraded my CU, and he said if it ever trips, let him know and he'll come back and uprate it, but he won't hold his breath. That was three years ago.

mcb's / rcbo will normaly accept 1.2 times their rating happily.. surprising isn't it!

T-M

Last week I accidentally put 15-16kW (65-69A) through B32 MCB couldn't work out why sometimes it tripped and others not.

Then realised it was it I brought all 6 channels of lights up full immediately, rather than a gentler fade.
Dimmers were 6 channel 2500W, and each channel had either 4* 650W fresnels or 2* 1250W floods.

Dimmer was on a 65A plug, just the rack box inside split it to 2 *32A MCB's to feed 2 dimmers.

I split the lights out to lower the load later....